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B1Gfan
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Topic: AAA District Duals Teams / Seeding Posted: Jan 13 2025 at 10:04am |
I was watching the match of the week (production gets better every year by the way) and they mentioned that district duals seeding is coming up this weekend - the season is slipping away from me! This year only the QFinalists make it to Altoona, and there seems to be a huge advantage to finish 2nd in our district if you want to make it to Altoona, but that is a discussion for another day.
Here is my current field, kind of in an order. As always, we do not know who will submit for consideration, but I came up with at least 26 teams that could/should submit and there are probably more worthy of consideration.
Top 4 Boyertown (lock for 1 seed until CRS/GBurg) CRS CRN QTown (I assume Gaj is fine?)
Locks Oxford Pennridge Pennsbury Spring Ford
I think they have the resume Sun Valley Souderton Hatboro Haverford Garnet Valley Neshaminy CB West
Outside my cut line Avon Grove Conestoga DTown E DTown W Kennett Methacton N Penn OJR (a couple of Bechtolds could change my mind?) Upper Dublin WC Henderson
Where did I mess up?
Edited by B1Gfan - Jan 13 2025 at 10:06am
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mo bloodyoung
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Posted: Jan 13 2025 at 4:32pm |
Kennett beat Sun Valley
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mo bloodyoung
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Posted: Jan 13 2025 at 5:01pm |
Here's mine. After the top 8, let's just try to get some good matchups and not have league rivals match up early:
1. Boyertown 16. Neshaminy
8. Spring-Ford 9. Sun Valley
5. Pennridge 12. Kennett
4. Council Rock North 13. Souderton
3. Quakertown 14. Garnet Valley
6. Oxford 11. Hatboro Horsham
7. Pennsbury 10. Haverford High
2. Council Rock South 15. West Chester Henderson
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B1Gfan
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Posted: Jan 13 2025 at 5:09pm |
mo bloodyoung wrote:
Kennett beat Sun Valley | Avon Grove beat Pennsbury.
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B1Gfan
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Posted: Jan 13 2025 at 5:15pm |
Apparently I had 15, hmm
Looks like we matched on 14, as usual it will probably just come down to the last couple spots. I doubt it ever goes back 24, but the 9-24 matchups this year would actually be quite good.
Edited by B1Gfan - Jan 13 2025 at 5:16pm
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mo bloodyoung
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Posted: Jan 13 2025 at 5:23pm |
They should go back to four sites too... some of those matchups will make for some long hikes.
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tilts
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Posted: Jan 14 2025 at 9:26am |
The big monkey wrenches with head to head dual results is...
Pennsbury with good wins against Sun Valley, Kennett, and Spring-Ford. Then some tough losses against Avon Grove and Garnet
Sun Valley with losses to Garnet (avenged*), Kennett, and Pennsbury. And wins over Souderton, GV*
Garnet with wins over Sun Valley* and Pennsbury. And losses to Haverford, Spring-Ford, and SV*
Souderton over Kennett, but Hatboro over Souderton
Someone will certainly be seeded lower than a team they beat. I guess we will just have to wrestle the matches and figure this all out.
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Chinwhipped
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Posted: Jan 15 2025 at 11:53am |
2025 District 1 AAA Duals bracket forecast -
1. Quakertown (7-2) 16. Methacton (10-2)
8. Springford (9-4) 9. Sun Valley (9-3)
5. Pennridge (4-4) 12. Central Bucks West (7-2)
4. Council Rock North (8-4) 13. Hatboro Horsham (4-4)
3. Council Rock South (9-1) 14. Souderton (13-5)
6. Oxford (6-3) 11. Garnett Valley (7-3)
7. Pennsbury (9-7) 10. Haverford (12-1)
2. Boyertown (14-2) 15. Neshaminy (13-6)
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James Hellwig
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Posted: Jan 16 2025 at 9:46am |
2025 District 1 AAA Duals bracket forecast - the top 3 are obvious...it's just a matter of order. I'm going CRS over Quakertown and Boyertown. CRS comes in a bit underrated as a dual team (kind of odd to say) and they just knocked off PA#6 Gettysburg. Their only loss is a team ranked in the top 25 in the US. Quakertown is healthy at the right time and transitive theory gives them a slight nod over Boyertown. QT has a W over Saucon Valley who beat Boyertown. North is a step down but the clear #4. Their lightweights are going to pick up a lot of bonus, but their achilles will be their lineup from 152 to 285 where they will also give up a lot of bonus. After that, it's a mess! There are so many "this team beat this team and this team but lost to this team" scenarios that I wouldn't want to be on the committee come Sunday. I think Oxford deserves the 5 and is just a tad bit better than the next chunk of teams from 6-12ish. Pennsbury and Pennridge are the true anomalies to me and are going to be tough draws wherever they end up. I probably have Pennsbury too high (loss to Avon Grove???) and Pennridge too low.
1. Council Rock South (10-1) 16. Neshaminy (13-7)
8. Garnett Valley (8-3) 9. Sun Valley (6-3)
5. Oxford (6-3) 12. Haverford (12-1)
4. Council Rock North (9-4) 13. Pennridge (4-5)
3. Boyertown (15-2) 14. Methacton (11-2)
6. Pennsbury (10-7) 11. Souderton (14-5)
7. Springford (10-4) 10. Kennett (6-3)
2. Quakertown (8-2) 15. Hatboro Horsham (3-4)
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dicemen99
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Posted: Jan 17 2025 at 8:21pm |
Hearing some sentiment about multiple teams being the top seed at District Duals, but I'm not sure how the committee can justify seeding any way but: 1 - CR South 2 - Quakertown 3 - Boyertown
South has only lost to the #24 team in the country and recently beat Gettysburg when they were ranked the #6 team in the state.
Quakertown has lost to probably a better team in Northampton, but also lost to Parkland. They get the #2 over Boyertown because of the Saucon Valley dual comparison.
Boyertown with the early lead, but just got smoked by Saucon Valley and Quakertown beat them.
Boyertown over CR North at the Bealer duals and I think North is #4.
Maybe it turns out different on the mat, but from a seeding perspective you just can't justify any other team but South at #1 based on THIS year's resume. And that doesn't even take into account the fact that they are the defending champs and have won 5 out of the last 8.
These things get political with the coaches at the meeting, so who knows how it will go. But I'd like to see the argument presented for a team other than South to be seeded #1. Again - it will be close this year, so who knows how it will turn out when they hit the mat.
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Chinwhipped
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Posted: Jan 23 2025 at 10:17am |
I see my top four worked out perfectly. Last night CB West beat the 9 seed, Souderton 35-34 while giving up a forfeit at 107. Seems like a lot of good teams are left out of district duals with the current process of having a group of coaches gathering in a smoked filled room to decide who is in and who is out. They did away with the 'seeding meeting' for individual post season and it would be good if they did the same for team duals post season. Too much bias. It looks like the same people voting in the rankings are picking the 16 teams for district duals.
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mo bloodyoung
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Posted: Jan 23 2025 at 11:14am |
Chinwhipped wrote:
I see my top four worked out perfectly. Last night CB West beat the 9 seed, Souderton 35-34 while giving up a forfeit at 107. Seems like a lot of good teams are left out of district duals with the current process of having a group of coaches gathering in a smoked filled room to decide who is in and who is out. They did away with the 'seeding meeting' for individual post season and it would be good if they did the same for team duals post season. Too much bias. It looks like the same people voting in the rankings are picking the 16 teams for district duals. |
Which team got snubbed? If you look at every team from 6-16, they all lost to someone they "shouldn't have." If we're being completely honest, there are a couple good teams and a bunch of average squads that could win or lose any night depending on the matchups.
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gmacnamara
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Posted: Jan 23 2025 at 11:20am |
I wouldn’t read too much into that Souderton loss last night. I understand they are dealing with some illness, their 189 was not able to go as well as another that tried to wrestle ill. Great effort on both sides. Congratulations to CBW on their victory.
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Chinwhipped
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Posted: Jan 23 2025 at 12:01pm |
mo bloodyoung wrote:
Chinwhipped wrote:
I see my top four worked out perfectly. Last night CB West beat the 9 seed, Souderton 35-34 while giving up a forfeit at 107. Seems like a lot of good teams are left out of district duals with the current process of having a group of coaches gathering in a smoked filled room to decide who is in and who is out. They did away with the 'seeding meeting' for individual post season and it would be good if they did the same for team duals post season. Too much bias. It looks like the same people voting in the rankings are picking the 16 teams for district duals. |
Which team got snubbed? If you look at every team from 6-16, they all lost to someone they "shouldn't have." If we're being completely honest, there are a couple good teams and a bunch of average squads that could win or lose any night depending on the matchups. |
Didn't say anyone was snubbed. I am saying I don't know how the teams are chosen. Yes the top 4-6 are pretty cut and dry but after that it becomes someone's opinion. You can look at individual post season districts, regions, states and know exactly how each wrestler got there and how they were seeded. You may not agree with it but the process for seeding and advancing wresters is well defined. The participants for District Duals is done on one Sunday afternoon in January by vote. If I'm a coach I say give me a defined process so I know how to get the team to qualify to what amounts to extra matches that only 16 teams will get.
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ChuckFalzioli
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Posted: Jan 23 2025 at 12:19pm |
Chinwhipped wrote:
mo bloodyoung wrote:
Chinwhipped wrote:
I see my top four worked out perfectly. Last night CB West beat the 9 seed, Souderton 35-34 while giving up a forfeit at 107. Seems like a lot of good teams are left out of district duals with the current process of having a group of coaches gathering in a smoked filled room to decide who is in and who is out. They did away with the 'seeding meeting' for individual post season and it would be good if they did the same for team duals post season. Too much bias. It looks like the same people voting in the rankings are picking the 16 teams for district duals.  |
Which team got snubbed? If you look at every team from 6-16, they all lost to someone they "shouldn't have." If we're being completely honest, there are a couple good teams and a bunch of average squads that could win or lose any night depending on the matchups. |
Didn't say anyone was snubbed. I am saying I don't know how the teams are chosen. Yes the top 4-6 are pretty cut and dry but after that it becomes someone's opinion. You can look at individual post season districts, regions, states and know exactly how each wrestler got there and how they were seeded. You may not agree with it but the process for seeding and advancing wresters is well defined. The participants for District Duals is done on one Sunday afternoon in January by vote. If I'm a coach I say give me a defined process so I know how to get the team to qualify to what amounts to extra matches that only 16 teams will get. | I agree. It is way too political.
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mo bloodyoung
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Posted: Jan 23 2025 at 12:26pm |
ChuckFalzioli wrote:
I agree. It is way too political. |
How is it political? lol
The only teams from the rankings that didn't make the bracket were Kennett and Downingtown West. West has losses to W. C. Henderson and Avon Grove. Avon Grove has losses to Great Valley and Lower Merion but also a win over Pennsbury, who is the 6 seed. Pennsbury also has losses to Garnet and Pennridge, but seeded over both. But Pennridge has a loss to Souderton, who lost to C. B. West who lost to C. B. East who lost to Downingtown West and the cycle goes on and on.
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Chinwhipped
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Posted: Jan 23 2025 at 12:37pm |
mo bloodyoung wrote:
ChuckFalzioli wrote:
I agree. It is way too political. |
How is it political? lol
The only teams from the rankings that didn't make the bracket were Kennett and Downingtown West. West has losses to W. C. Henderson and Avon Grove. Avon Grove has losses to Great Valley and Lower Merion but also a win over Pennsbury, who is the 6 seed. Pennsbury also has losses to Garnet and Pennridge, but seeded over both. But Pennridge has a loss to Souderton, who lost to C. B. West who lost to C. B. East who lost to Downingtown West and the cycle goes on and on. |
Saying its political is maybe a bit loaded. Saying there's no defined process for how a team qualifies for district duals is simply fact. I mean what I'm hearing is that 6-16 could essentially be drawn out of a hat and in fact that's what it looks like was done. As if the people selecting just throw there hands up in the air and say ok I'll vote for Charlie's team. There's no process.
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mo bloodyoung
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Posted: Jan 23 2025 at 12:42pm |
Chinwhipped wrote:
Saying its political is maybe a bit loaded. Saying there's no defined process for how a team qualifies for district duals is simply fact. I mean what I'm hearing is that 6-16 could essentially be drawn out of a hat and in fact that's what it looks like was done. As if the people selecting just throw there hands up in the air and say ok I'll vote for Charlie's team. There's no process. |
If the bottom 10 teams are all about the same, why do you think the seeds are bad? I don't know how you'd come up with a system like football or basketball has because some teams wrestle the minimum dual meets and some teams like to load up on them.
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Chinwhipped
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Posted: Jan 23 2025 at 1:06pm |
mo bloodyoung wrote:
Chinwhipped wrote:
Saying its political is maybe a bit loaded. Saying there's no defined process for how a team qualifies for district duals is simply fact. I mean what I'm hearing is that 6-16 could essentially be drawn out of a hat and in fact that's what it looks like was done. As if the people selecting just throw there hands up in the air and say ok I'll vote for Charlie's team. There's no process. |
If the bottom 10 teams are all about the same, why do you think the seeds are bad? I don't know how you'd come up with a system like football or basketball has because some teams wrestle the minimum dual meets and some teams like to load up on them. |
I don't care how the bottom 10 are seeded. I care about who is in and who is out and on what basis. There is no basis other than a bunch of guys in a room voting. Why don't we seed individual districts, regions and states that way? I'll tell you why. People complained every year until someone said enough and defined a process to seed wrestlers in a tournament. Now when someone complains you simply point them to the website and say we just plug the numbers in here. There's no human involved. lol.
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dicemen99
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Posted: Jan 23 2025 at 1:15pm |
mo bloodyoung wrote:
ChuckFalzioli wrote:
I agree. It is way too political. |
How is it political? lol
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Explain Quakertown at #1 and South at 3 based on resumes. Not that it matters anyway, but this is an example.
I've been a representative at the seeding meeting. If you think it's not all political or rather coaches jockeying for position, then we've been to different meetings.
There is no reason we don't have an objective power ranking setup like virtually everywhere else in all sports. The results may not always come out right there either, but at least coaches know what their teams need to do to earn their seed.
Right now the seeding process is equivalent to the voting on coach of the year awards.
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