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COVID-19...afraid or not afraid

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    Posted: Jan 27 2021 at 10:59am
I like to read people’s banter about COVID.  This forum topic is properly labeled so go at it please.  This virus has a underlying influence on every one of these posts.  But now we will be able to bicker...it’s fun
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Crapolla Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 27 2021 at 12:23pm
Not afraid at all! Its a fraud
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cbal24 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 27 2021 at 2:26pm
It's a fraud?  You mean to say you have no one in your life that has been effected by the virus?  I've already lost family members and friends and have another close friend fighting for his life in the hospital.  It is not a fraud.  I can see not agreeing with the way things have been handled and how it has been overly politicized, but to deny it is a legitimate public health concern is just silly.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Crapolla Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 27 2021 at 2:31pm
For Elementary, Middle and HS aged kids the numbers do not add up.  There is basically no risk.
The closing of schools and sports and restaurants has been fraudulent.   Now that Sleepy is in office, they are wanting to open things.  It is BS.  
There is basically zero chance of a kid getting it and dying.  No more than getting a horrible flu, or stomach sickness and dying.

So in the HS wrestling world, It is a fraud.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote cbal24 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 27 2021 at 2:48pm
Interesting that you say that since there's more than just the kids in the wrestling world.  Shikellamy just had to shut down their wrestling program for 14 days because the head coach has Covid and at least 2 of his wrestlers tested positive, as well.  Kids can get Covid.  It may not have serious consequences for the kids, but what about the parents, grandparents, and any other adult they come in contact with.  The narrow view of only focusing on the kids only shows a disregard for societal interactions they have other than the sports arena.

I want things to get back to normal as much as the next guy, but I've seen the damage Covid can do.  Hopefully we get back to normal soon because Covid is causing societal stress that just isn't healthy.




Edited by cbal24 - Jan 27 2021 at 2:49pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ancienthatteroldram Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 27 2021 at 4:06pm
BD:      Double double, toil and trouble 
           Covid talk is never subtle,
           some opinions that are spoken
           will be banned as "strict verboten".
           In the cauldron bubbling hot 
           add sad tales of woe and Lot.
           Chicken Little, Mother Goose,
           St. Fauci cooked the golden goose.


Edited by ancienthatteroldram - Jan 27 2021 at 4:10pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Crapolla Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 27 2021 at 4:16pm
LOL
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dicemen99 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 27 2021 at 4:27pm
cbal:

Exactly.  


Doubtful that some will even bother to read the above because it has CDC attached to it (although for the life of me I can't fathom how an agency that was recently regarded as "best in class" is now deemed less reliable than Facebook by 40% of our population), but it's a scary reminder of what we are dealing with.  That's the immediate repercussion of a 10 team, 130 total personnel tournament in which a few asymptomatic wrestlers participated.

IMO school officials are doing a pretty good job with everything considering the situation. I'm sure many on here would think differently if in a position where they have to consider the needs of an entire school community, rather than just their immediate family.  There is really no "correct" decision for them and their jobs, and people in that communities lives, may depend on that decision.

So far, so good, we're wrestling.  Let's keep our fingers crossed that it continues - this is really going to depend on our coaches and wrestlers taking this seriously.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Blast Double Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 27 2021 at 7:03pm
Cbal23 :..be honest...we’re/are your relatives “in good shape”
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Blast Double Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 27 2021 at 7:05pm
“Healthy “


Because NOBODY healthy dies of The Vid
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ko906 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 27 2021 at 7:29pm
For me, we as people should be able to make the decisions for ourselves and our kids. If someone feels threatened by COVID then they can pull their kid. However, for those of us who feel fine and don’t have contact with grandparents and people who are at risk, our kids should be allowed to wrestle without so many restrictions. Everyone’s situation is different and we( our kids) shouldn’t all be punished just because some people are scared about Covid, especially when the people who are making the decisions (school board members) don’t have any skin in the game. I don’t presume to know what is best for someone else’s situation, so I’d like the same courtesy from others.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Mctuna40 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 27 2021 at 10:03pm
COVID19 is a threat! It is the furthest thing from a Fraud in some demographics!  If you are Old, Diabetic, Obese, or live in other high inflammatory states as a human YOU ARE AT RISK! I know multiple people who have had horrible outcomes from Covid19! Dont wrestle, play LAX or attend school if you are any of the above. 

Having said that in this demographic HS or College age kids it is almost nonexistent at causing death or anything more than mild flu symptoms! I’ve been harping since mid May about the Mental health effect that is being hoisted on our youth by the Quarantining of the young and healthy, FOR THE FIRST TIME IN OUR NATIONS HISTORY!  CDC did a study that showed massive increases in Addiction, OD’s, Anxiety, depression, Suicidal ideations and death by suicide! People close to My family have been touched by mental illness and a wrestler I coached died of an OD during Covid19.  The reaction from society schools and government for our youth has been down-right non scientific! It’s been politically and has costs lives and countless unintended consequences in this demographic!

Follow the F’n Science!


Edited by Mctuna40 - Jan 27 2021 at 10:05pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ancienthatteroldram Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 27 2021 at 10:38pm
dice:   "" ..a scary reminder of what we are dealing with".
According to the CDC report cited we don't know 1) if any people testing positive required hospitalization
2) how serious and what if any, were the symptoms of those testing positive and symptomatic. 

What we do know is that  1) """Local health authorities reported the death of ONE (my emphasis) adult contacted aged>50 years.""" We do NOT know if that person suffered from co-morbidities; nor do we know how old he/she actually was   2)   130 people attended the tournament and NOT ONE person died from or with covid, a mortality rate of .000000%   3) 446 people came into contact with those who attended and ONE person over 50 years old died, a mortality rate of .0022%.  

If this CDC Report(MMWR) were to be submitted as a term paper, intending to proof the existential threat C-19 poses, it would receive a grade of D minus. This report  in its' closing paragraph concludes, that covid-19 poses "severe outcomes including death" - it proofs the opposite. High school students face almost no threat of death due to the virus and the community only a marginal threat. 


Edited by ancienthatteroldram - Jan 28 2021 at 8:56am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dicemen99 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 28 2021 at 9:50am
Originally posted by ancienthatteroldram ancienthatteroldram wrote:

dice:   "" ..a scary reminder of what we are dealing with".
According to the CDC report cited we don't know 1) if any people testing positive required hospitalization
2) how serious and what if any, were the symptoms of those testing positive and symptomatic. 

What we do know is that  1) """Local health authorities reported the death of ONE (my emphasis) adult contacted aged>50 years.""" We do NOT know if that person suffered from co-morbidities; nor do we know how old he/she actually was   2)   130 people attended the tournament and NOT ONE person died from or with covid, a mortality rate of .000000%   3) 446 people came into contact with those who attended and ONE person over 50 years old died, a mortality rate of .0022%.  

If this CDC Report(MMWR) were to be submitted as a term paper, intending to proof the existential threat C-19 poses, it would receive a grade of D minus. This report  in its' closing paragraph concludes, that covid-19 poses "severe outcomes including death" - it proofs the opposite. High school students face almost no threat of death due to the virus and the community only a marginal threat. 

I love the comorbidity argument - and the old age argument, comes up all the time!

I know, I know.  Sick people, fat people, old people - who needs them!!!!  Probably going to kick at some time anyway.

And then the mortality rate argument.  Because Covid is only a marginal threat to the community. You're right - I would guess that hospitalizations, medical care expenses, productivity decline all were minimal, right.  The fact that the report was focused on community spread, well so what, let's trot the strawmen out.

BTW - you need to brush up on your math - mortality is .22% from tracing so far in that report.  

If that is what you took from the report, you're just politicking.  Why did I put the link up and in what context?  If you read my post, it was to highlight the difficult position that administrators are in now.  A relatively small tournament, with limited personnel in attendance can create exposure for a multitude in the immediate.  In the coming months - 2 months, 3 months down the line - would you care to extrapolate how many exposures it caused?  

If you want to argue about the seriousness of contracting Covid - that's a different argument and really isn't relevant to the fact that it can be spread by someone of any age.  And the fact that teenagers are less likely to exhibit serious symptoms - well that kind of makes them more viable "spreaders" don't you think?

School administrators are in a difficult position of weighing the risks on both sides of the equation.  If it were that easy, we wouldn't be in the relative chaos concerning the Covid situation that we have currently. The "scary reminder" is that this is a virus that is much more serious than the flu to a substantial portion of our population - aged and at-risk.  Substantial portion, no matter what your attitude is towards them.  And the rate of transmission is high.  You see the positive rates coming out of that study, in addition to the percentage of positives that were asymptomatic - well, I'm not sure how someone can look at that data and not reasonably deduce that this event accelerated the rate of exposure for that community significantly.  That's a serious concern for a school administrator or any public official, and one that really can't be dismissed if they are doing their job.  

There are really no easy decisions in this regard - despite the fact that people on both sides of this issue seem to think there are.


Edited by dicemen99 - Jan 28 2021 at 9:52am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Crapolla Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 28 2021 at 10:04am
SNORE
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dicemen99 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 28 2021 at 10:05am
Originally posted by ko906 ko906 wrote:

For me, we as people should be able to make the decisions for ourselves and our kids. If someone feels threatened by COVID then they can pull their kid. However, for those of us who feel fine and don’t have contact with grandparents and people who are at risk, our kids should be allowed to wrestle without so many restrictions. Everyone’s situation is different and we( our kids) shouldn’t all be punished just because some people are scared about Covid, especially when the people who are making the decisions (school board members) don’t have any skin in the game. I don’t presume to know what is best for someone else’s situation, so I’d like the same courtesy from others.

On the surface that's a pretty reasonable take.  But an impossible one for an official who has been elected to make decisions that benefit the community they represent.  And all of the school administrators answer to those people.  They should be weighing the benefits and the risks and then making what they feel is the best decision.

It also makes the assumption that you will not act recklessly and needlessly endanger others.  Which is likely true in your case, but I'd caution against making that assumption for an entire community.  It's kind of why we have laws and law enforcement.

I'm all for the personal liberties that we enjoy in this country.  It's just not an argument that applies to all situations.  At least not in this country at any time in its existence.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote cbal24 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 28 2021 at 1:12pm
https://data.cdc.gov/NCHS/Provisional-COVID-19-Deaths-Focus-on-Ages-0-18-Yea/nr4s-juj3

This link goes to the CDC statistics data for Covid-19 deaths.  It provides only information on deaths with no information on other health issues.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote Mctuna40 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 28 2021 at 11:04pm
Originally posted by dicemen99 dicemen99 wrote:

Originally posted by ancienthatteroldram ancienthatteroldram wrote:

dice:   "" ..a scary reminder of what we are dealing with".
According to the CDC report cited we don't know 1) if any people testing positive required hospitalization
2) how serious and what if any, were the symptoms of those testing positive and symptomatic. 

What we do know is that  1) """Local health authorities reported the death of ONE (my emphasis) adult contacted aged>50 years.""" We do NOT know if that person suffered from co-morbidities; nor do we know how old he/she actually was   2)   130 people attended the tournament and NOT ONE person died from or with covid, a mortality rate of .000000%   3) 446 people came into contact with those who attended and ONE person over 50 years old died, a mortality rate of .0022%.  

If this CDC Report(MMWR) were to be submitted as a term paper, intending to proof the existential threat C-19 poses, it would receive a grade of D minus. This report  in its' closing paragraph concludes, that covid-19 poses "severe outcomes including death" - it proofs the opposite. High school students face almost no threat of death due to the virus and the community only a marginal threat. 

I love the comorbidity argument - and the old age argument, comes up all the time!

I know, I know.  Sick people, fat people, old people - who needs them!!!!  Probably going to kick at some time anyway.

Your lack of empathy for adolescents and the mental health side of this issue is DEAFENING!

Anxiety, Depression, drug and Alcohol addiction, ODs, Suicidal Ideations and death from suicide in our younger population... have all skyrocketed during this time of shutting schools, preventing sports and the unpresidential policy of quarantining the young and healthy! There clearly is more of a risk of these issues than COVID-19 health issues in this Demographic!!!!  
I can not attempt to judge your soul or read your heart but I question your one sided view of this complex issue!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Low Single Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 29 2021 at 7:06am
I know one thing if your view on this virus differs from the admins, you are uneducated and have a hard time understanding lol  Then you will be censored.  I thought wrestlers/wrestling community would not be so soft about a virus that has 99.7% recovery rate.  The response to the China Virus is hurting a generation of kids, that's a fact.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Blast Double Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: Jan 30 2021 at 2:35pm
It’s flu season now and our elderly/sick, as always, are in risk of dying...are we to social distance/wear masks until this is not an issue?  In the summer when heat stroke is an issue for some we could block out the sun.
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